This is another reddit inspired post. The post that got me thinking about this is Rage of a NewBro. You can go ahead and read the post, and the comments too, but this is a VERY long story, as in a page of small reddit font. The tl;dr is the NewBro was accused by a corporate bigwig of making the corporation look bad because he lost a 200 mISK ship and that lowered the alliance killboard stats.

You know, I’ve heard this all before. I’ve heard it from by buddy in Fatal Ascension who was “counseled” about his contributions to the killboard. We heard it from Rixx Javix not long ago when he was kicked from Tuskers for supposedly not living up to their ideals. This new bro who was in Nexus Fleet. I’ve even heard this sort of put down much, much closer to home.

And you know what? It’s all bullshit.

To everyone who has ever said something like this to another player, especially a new bro or a carebear, you’re the one who’s making it look bad. If the killboard looks bad to your eyes, it’s because you have failed to destroy enough ships to make up for us who are not so PvP l33t as you are.

Rather than run someone down for not living up to your assumptions about what winning Eve Online looks like, why don’t you get off your lazy ass and make up for it? Go out and destroy more ships. Get your l33t PvP buds into their pro-fit l33t PvP ships and go blow someone up. What’s that? You don’t have any ISK? You’re fresh out of l33t PvP ships? Stop making me look bad! Any moron can make ISK in this game. It’s really easy.

That last bit was just trolling. I didn’t really mean it, even if it is true. We all choose to “win” Eve Online our own way. To some, that’s how many solo combats they win. For others, it’s how much bling they can put on their pimped out Incursion Nightmare. For other’s it’s how much ISK they can make trading or how much ore they can refine or how many capital ships they can build and sell. But all these ways of “winning” have one thing in common. They are personal measures of success. Corporation and alliance killboards are not. It is wrong headed to think of them as such.

Those types of killboards are not even part of the official game. There is no mechanism in Eve Online for viewing an aggregate corporation or alliance kill mail. Killboards have come into Eve Online from other games – I would say first person shooters where that sort of thing seems to get people off. But Eve Online isn’t a first person shooter. It’s a sandbox. People are free to play anyway they want. Denigrating them for playing it their way is stupid. If you don’t think so, take your first person shooter attitude and go play Dust 514 or something. Around here you’re just another loud mouthed ass-wipe making us all look bad.

Fly Careful

– Mabrick

He’s been around the block a time or five. With over 15 years of MMO playing under his belt and a memory that reaches back to pencils and dice, he offers his insights into the not so virtual reality we call Eve Online.

Recommended Mabrick posts:

The State of Wormhole Space
Industrial Indifference With One Exception


  1. Billbo


    July 28, 2013 at 7:42 pm Reply
  2. Roger the Alien

    Nexus Fleet is a bunch of fags anyway, feel bad for anyone who fly’s with that bunch.

    July 28, 2013 at 8:15 pm Reply
    1. troll

      I love a statement that just oozes intelligence.

      You must be FA.

      July 29, 2013 at 11:39 pm Reply
  3. brain_up


    July 28, 2013 at 9:04 pm Reply
  4. Pregnant Wombat

    redditors getting mad at other redditors for making redditors look bad in front of redditors

    July 28, 2013 at 9:06 pm Reply
  5. MabrickGoHomeUrDrunk

    So a corp or alliance is allowed to expect its members to uphold some level of standards? Ummm, sure Eve is a sandbox, but if you want your own measures of success, seperate from those of anyone else, maybe you dont belong in such and such corporation or alliance, because you clearly suck.

    July 28, 2013 at 10:51 pm Reply
  6. Red Teufel

    if you suck gtfo. it’s simple. it’s not your KB it’s the alliance/corporations KB.

    July 29, 2013 at 12:37 am Reply
  7. Stats for Noobs

    if you win you learn nothing cause you have done it right. when you loose you should have learned something… negative stats say nothing about real skills, only show that you have the balls to risk a fight against better people / bad situations…

    this kb stuff is for people who don’t have the rl peen…

    July 29, 2013 at 12:42 am Reply
  8. zzzzz

    This is dumb. Sure you shouldn’t put down newbros, but if people are simply bad….or there is an expectation of a specific amount of skill within the corp then ya you berate them to see if they will fix their shit. If not, you kick them

    July 29, 2013 at 2:48 am Reply
  9. Internet Lawyer

    “Corporation and alliance killboards are not [measures of success]. It is wrong headed to think of them as such.”

    I think I see where your mistake is …..

    July 29, 2013 at 4:03 am Reply
  10. Ral Foley

    I slightly agree with this. In the context of him not being “1337” in a non-1337 corp, sure, putting him down is wrong. That is, or course, assuming it wasn’t a silly loss they should have known better about. Example; in our FW corp, someone losses a Golem. Upon examination, it was in Jita, poorly fit, and not in line with our stated objectives. He was therefore reprimanded (then kicked for have 0 PvP activity).

    It is all situational, though I do happen across those individuals who look down on everyone if they do not meet their unrealistic or down right stupid standards. They tend to put anyone down that they can, and in general are none to helpful.

    July 29, 2013 at 4:29 am Reply
  11. More Than The Sum Of Its Parts

    Sorry mate, gotta disagree with you here.

    The actions of an individual reflect upon the group. There is no greater truism when working with others. The CEO(s) in question might be phrasing it poorly, but what they are saying is that poor losses by a few people make the corporation as a whole look bad. I can think of numerous examples where the actions of a few members gave their entire corporation a bad reputation–and as a CEO, it is your job to avoid that at all costs.

    July 29, 2013 at 4:31 am Reply
  12. Saint Mick

    Totally agree with all of this. You’re going to get your fair share of “You’re talking crap mate” style comments, as the majority of people who interact on this site are the knuckle-dragging morons who DO think the killboard is the be-all and end-all of the game.

    July 29, 2013 at 10:18 am Reply
    1. whatever

      Most “l33t” PVP corps have academies. If you’re new – go to the academy, learn the basics. If you show yourself good – welcome to the main corp. If you dont meet the standards – the CEO will rightfully decline your application. Because it’s up to him to decide what are the corp standards.

      And believe me – there are a lot of CEOs that dont give a shit about KB stats. But be ready to find out that your corpmates are weak in PVP.

      July 29, 2013 at 1:41 pm Reply
  13. distant-observer

    condescending , self entitled heros in eve. where is story here ? I´ve played online for about 15 years now and whenever it got kind of competitive , a certain percentage of those people / players that are “better”, more experienced and better equipped feel thexy have the right to talk down, to others, belittle them, insult them. the fact that the internet protects them and provides both the recipient of the insults and the jerk with some kind of protection anonymity, increases not only how, but also how many people feel so uber and call themselves mr. (or mrs.) know-it-all-let-me-explain-the-world-to-you-idiots….

    and since eve has the reputation for having a steep learning curve and bein hardcore, those who are jerks and idiots and whatnot somehow are
    a: more commonly found than in other games
    b: sometimes even highly intelligent which makes their insults even more sophisticated (but nonetheless idiotic)

    the rage and hate and general tone between eve players sometimes is just not understandable. so much bottled up frustration…

    July 29, 2013 at 1:29 pm Reply
  14. Glad I Left

    Nexus Fleet is bad for EVE and causes new-bros to leave the game!!! Their main corp is Critical Mass (CRTM) with only 150 members and those guys honestly think they are the best corp in EVE. They recruit brand new players and are paid good isk for each recruitment from the CEO then speak very poorly about and rage at the new players, all the other corps in the alliance and other “friendly” alliances daily.

    I was in CRTM and if you are friendly to them, you should know they think poorly of more than just new players but EVERYONE else in EVE, it is the culture they developed.

    CRTM would purposely change their alliance doctrines to ships and mods that they had but their alliance training corp did not, just to force the new guys to always fly logi ships for them and then everyone in CRTM would laugh about it! They recruit brand new players into their alliance training corp and put them on a mandatory 6 month “training plan” and you guessed it, it is focused on logi.

    Nexus Fleet is bad for the game and there were many days that I felt bad about being a part of CRTM.

    July 29, 2013 at 2:17 pm Reply
    1. Glad you left

      You’re just talking shit mate. The training plan was designed to take a new guy from scratch to being able to competently a battlecruiser. Logi pilots could switch out half way through and train logi related skills.
      The doctrines were revised after the cane was nerfed and no one “purposely changed the training plan” so that the new bros flew logi and honestly if you think that then you clearly are a retard and don’t belong here.
      Good riddance.

      July 29, 2013 at 11:37 pm Reply
  15. rixxjavix

    Join Stay Frosty. I put my money where my mouth is and formed a Corp where we dont give a crap about killboards. 140+ members and more kills than anyone else in our region, 95% solo! You can be good in Eve and not be a dick.

    July 29, 2013 at 3:27 pm Reply
  16. styopa

    It’s almost like the people who pathologically obsess about gameplay are embittered by the self-loathing caused by having the most important thing in your life be…playing a game?

    July 29, 2013 at 4:03 pm Reply
  17. Nexus Since Noob

    Im in Nexus and have been for sometime. I joined them when first started playing eve about 12 months ago and i can say i am really happy I did. They taught me (via classes, combat xp, and convos with Vets) almost everything i know about the game and have helped make me into a fully competent pilot and an FC. I am now in CRTM and can assure you we love our newbros. We constantly think of ways for 2-4 month old pilots to be of value in PvP and put alot of emphasis on creating compositions for our newbros to kick ass in. I was also present at the fight which resulted in this newbro’s kick and its not about KB efficiency, as who gives a shit about 200 mill on the KB. It was about him not listening to advice, having multiple stupid and directly advised against losses, and then being incredibly defensive when being criticized for his mistakes, which escalated into a fight with a VP who kicked him. Could said VP have handled this differently. Yes, an i have spoken with him about such things in the past. Still in the end, this newbro wasn’t kick for losing these ships, he was kicked for being stupid, arrogant, and defensive. He was told many times not to move large amounts of assets in frigs through nullsec with no scout. He insisted he’d done it before and that he knew better. He was told not to engage the bait ship of an insidious gang in his PVE arty ferox when our pilots who could help him are deployed in fountain, but he knew better.

    Dont let the rage of one stubborn fool convince you of fallacies. Those who want to learn and are willing to be taught can find a home with us in Nexus. Those who want to be stubborn fools can join the ranks of the numerous YOLO plex buying dipshits we have already and will continue to kick.

    July 29, 2013 at 4:30 pm Reply
  18. Slothen

    Once again, Mabrick is vastly oversimplifying an aspect of the game in order to vilify “elite pvpers” and others non-noob-friendly forces. I agree only on the most basic point, that some corps can be unreasonable assholes about losses or mistakes, particularly when its just over killboard posturing. But for every example of this, there is another example when an (easily) avoidable loss matters in more ways than the impact on the victim’s wallet. If you’re unnecessarily losing hulks during a wardec, those juicy killmails hurt your corpmates by extending the war. If you lose your ratting ship in 0.0 because you didn’t use jump bridges or didn’t read intel, you’ve also hurt your corpmates.

    July 29, 2013 at 5:38 pm Reply
  19. Usual Suspects

    So some noob was raging that an alliance has some standards that he didn’t want to conform to? Big deal. He’ll probably quit in a week anyway.
    Without standards no one will learn anything, just do their own thing, and not show up to fights (sound familiar TEST?)
    Its nice to see some of the Sov holding alliances go out of their way to help bring the new guys into that part of the game.

    July 29, 2013 at 11:32 pm Reply
  20. Aonus_the_blaster_maniac

    lol i couldnt have said it better than this post. it made my day

    July 31, 2013 at 10:15 pm Reply
  21. Justin Cody

    time to go lose another 400M isk vengeance and make my director crap his pants

    August 5, 2013 at 12:53 am Reply

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