EVE University graduate. Drama Llama. Covert operations pilot. Poetic Stanziel has been very active in the blogging community bringing views from seasoned high-sec pilots, we please to share his stories and views on current Eve Online events and invite you to read more stories from his Poetic Discourse blog.

Poetic Discourse: EVE University and RvB – Fun Times Always

It’s been awhile. Since I’ve posted anything about EVE University. Since there’s been some juicy EVE Uni-RvB drama.

This is what happens when you try to get two incompatible alliances together. One is all for freeform PvP with a very limited set of rules (which are often breached nonetheless.) The other prefers safe gameplay with a heavy overlay of rules and procedures that their dictate play.

The last time we met our heroes, the Uni was up-in-arms when PvP happened. Namely that RvB, in all their PvP enthusiasm, attacked the University POS. No one told RvB that the POS was off-limits. RvB assumed it was just another target of opportunity. The Uni screamed, hollered, stamped its feet and called off the “war.”

Many months later, the University has forgiven RvB its transgressions, and they will be going to “war” again, this weekend. This time there will be a list of rules that each corporation has to follow. What not to do. Where not to go.

Before “war” happens, though, hilarity must ensue. Namely the University, once again, getting its panties in a knot when PvP happens.

The University has a large presence in the Hagilur lowsec pocket, out near Hek. Obstensibly for PvP learning purposes. They’ve been stationed there for a couple months now, so likely a lot of the University’s carebear industrialists have moved in also, to reap the extra rewards that they can’t quite get from highsec. So, it might explain the hollering that occurred when the following happened.

In a nutshell, a couple of RvB members wandered into the Hagilur pocket and killed a few Unistas. PvP in lowsec. The problem for the University, is that they mind-boggingly set RvB to +5 status. What that meant is that the folks blowing up the Unistas didn’t even appear on the Unista overviews, so until they examined kilmails, they didn’t really have a clue who had killed them. The RvBers doing the blowing up had no idea that the Uni had them set to blue.

Why one sets a PvP corporation to blue status is a question for the scholars, especially a PvP corporation that doesn’t set any outside corp to +5/+10. Perhaps the University diplomatic corp had some lower-rung RvB diplo agree in principle to mutual blue status. The University went ahead and did it, RvB never did. Mistakes were made, likely not on RvB’s part, since they’ve never had a policy of setting outsiders blue.

Back to the fun. Once what was happening was made clear, hollering started on the Uni chat channel (the one for members and alumni, not the horrible public channel). Here are some of the better comments (names redacted for their own protection):

Unista 01 > why are we giving rvb the privalege of fighting us when they can't follow rules?

Unista 02 > Did we agree to an armistice with them before our war next weekend? Can a diplo confirm?

Unista 03 > Who wants to bet some ISKies taht they'll attack our pos again?
Unista 01 > i'll take that bet & raise you that they'll podkill during our war.
Unista 03 > ROFL!! No doubt!

Unista 04 > We should cancel the big war and teach them a lesson. If they can't obey there standings how are they going to obey and of the rules for the war next week?

Unista 05 > RvB has no honor. We learned that during the last war. Why are we all surprised?

It goes on and on. Apparently the overriding sentiment is that fighting the University is a privilege and that RvB should consider itself lucky.

Then some of the complaining eventually reaches their forums.

It takes an ex-Uni to finally speak some sense to the mounting anger: “To the best of my knowledge, RvB doesn’t have any blues, since that would kind of defeat the point. They have like, extra-red, but that’s about it. Now come on … this idiocy is just embarassing the Uni. You’re on a public forum section, ffs.”

Other than the hilarity of what happened — that RvB is always getting itself in hot-water with the University when they actually do PvP — I found some of the director comments eye-opening. This one in particular: “… there are elements of every corporation that have their own methods and agendas. While it reflects poorly on the organization, it is (hopefully) an isloated few who are not adhering to the rules.”

That there is the crux of the issue. When you’re raised in an environment that is chock full of rules, you come to expect that the outside world should be rules-based as well. When the University says they love PvP, they love PvP within a well-defined framework, one in which the aggressing parties cannot stray. Even Kelduum Revaan has suggested a capture-the-flag system as a replacement to the war declaration system.

When Kelduum is running for CSM7, bear that in mind. When he says he loves PvP, remember two things: a) he doesn’t actually participate in PvP, and b) he wants to bring World of Warcraft-style battlegrounds to EVE Online, as a replacement for the war system.

Poetic Stanziel

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30 Comments

  1. Name

    you meanie!

    January 25, 2012 at 5:53 pm Reply
  2. herp_de_derp

    So eve uni is butthurt again. This isn't news..

    January 25, 2012 at 5:59 pm Reply
    1. "So poetic is butthurt again. This isn't news.."

      January 25, 2012 at 6:20 pm Reply
      1. Ogi

        Just get Poetic back into the Uni and all will be fine!

        January 26, 2012 at 2:41 pm Reply
  3. marcelojj

    Sometimes i think ´bout join some high sec alliances, for a less stressfull but yet fun enviroment for my eve life.

    Then i read these sort of things and imediatly change my mind.

    A overview that HIDES other pilots from you !? It´s like, like….there is nothing like this. Well, there were the Kiwis, from Ice Age movie. But we all know that they didn´t last long….for a reason.

    Good hunt.

    January 25, 2012 at 6:13 pm Reply
    1. herp_de_derp

      If you can't see them then they can't see you

      January 25, 2012 at 6:16 pm Reply
    2. Sold

      Any pilot with even basic skills knows you set up overviews based on certain criteria. Standings-based overviews should be the first thing you do when you decide to start pvping in Eve. The problem here was not the overviews. The problem was that the pvp targets were set to blue. That's just fail.

      January 26, 2012 at 1:53 pm Reply
    3. Danny Wittaker

      Actually, it makes a fair bit of sense for the Uni. They have this RoE thing.

      +5/+10 standings are set on the basis of agreeing to a mutual NAP or outright best-buds setup. Anyone that doesn't wanna fight BB blobs, just agrees to the NAP and that's the end of it. You can read that on the E-Uni Wiki, including how to get +5 NAP or whatever for your crap 1-man corp.

      So because the Uni wants to avoid noobs shooting people that have an NAP or whatever, the default overview that they guide people step-by-step in making–get this–hides them.

      Meanwhile, the majority of Eve PvP community operates on NBSI, and Blue? Shoot It If Bored.

      January 28, 2012 at 9:30 am Reply
  4. An RvB'er

    it will be an interesting war, not many Highsec corps/alliances can make the numbers and firepower of the uniblob other than RvB, the no podkilling is going to be a bitch, we have third party wars ongoing in rvb at the moment which will deter many rvb pilots from flying their shiney implant clones, the same will not be for the unistas, they will be able to fly their highgrade implants from all the incursion carbearing moneys……those pods are going to be extremely tempting ………….

    January 25, 2012 at 6:16 pm Reply
    1. Temmu

      Just Podkill and be done with it. Especially now with km's for pods

      January 25, 2012 at 7:27 pm Reply
  5. Akrasjel Lanate

    I was in EVE Uni(that ws on the begining so didnt know they were really like this)… oh god they really disapoint me

    January 25, 2012 at 6:19 pm Reply
  6. Goonfag

    hen Kelduum is running for CSM7, bear that in mind. When he says he loves PvP, remember two things: a) he doesn’t actually participate in PvP, and b) he wants to bring World of Warcraft-style battlegrounds to EVE Online, as a replacement for the war system.

    OMFG make it happen no more waiting 15h for some shitty tech pos timer just instant PVP

    January 25, 2012 at 6:29 pm Reply
    1. Goonfag

      Think about it none likes 0.0 structure grinds there the most boring piece of shit in this game. It could just have a system that doesn't allow titan blobs and everyone respawn in there same ship, maybe also have something to prevent people from flying estemel fitted tengus so only tech2 or named stuff is allowed.

      Low sec pirates/people would no longer have to travel 40 jumps just to find another gang doing the exact same thing. Some high sec care bear that wants to get wet with some PvP experience could also join. Less waiting for some structure timer and more fighting

      Add some player restriction like 5v5 or even allow fleet commanders have another fight with a hostile fc in some 250vs 250 brawls.
      It would be epic but this is eve were talking about it took them 1 year to figure they were going the wrong way with WiS.

      January 25, 2012 at 7:06 pm Reply
      1. Esg grunt

        Omfg, i am so dissapoint in this comment… I cannot neg rep it enuff!! Is there a doomsday neg rep button i can use?!

        Go back to WoW goonbear!

        January 26, 2012 at 4:05 am Reply
  7. guest

    Apart from the last sentence, I congratulate Poetic for bringing facts about E-UNI instead of the usual ranting for no reason (if the facts are true or not, whatever, metagaming is metagaming). It is an improvement over his normal speech about E-UNI

    January 25, 2012 at 6:35 pm Reply
    1. levij501

      Tru dat. Based on his previous articles, I normally think Poetic is a retard, but this is a good, solid article.

      January 26, 2012 at 5:16 am Reply
  8. bagehi

    Wait, you aren't supposed to shoot blue targets? All this time… Seriously though, the more I hear about Eve Uni, the more disgusted I am that I've suggested new players join them to learn the game. Because this isn't Eve.

    January 25, 2012 at 7:24 pm Reply
    1. Former uni

      It seems Eve uni is now more about carebearing. With long time players running incursion fleets 24/7 etc. The so called dec shield apparently works since they don't get many wars. In my uni days there was a war on at least every other week.
      Anyway, this poetic guy is obviously obsessed about eve uni, but I do think he has some valid points here and there. I'm actually not so sure about the benefits for noobs joining eve uni these days.

      January 25, 2012 at 10:02 pm Reply
  9. Former NC

    > It’s been awhile. Since I’ve posted anything about EVE University. Since everyone buttfucked me so hard the last time I tried to troll everyone with BS about irrelevant PVP groups."

    Fix'd your post for you, might wanna edit that in at some point convenient to yourself.

    January 25, 2012 at 7:34 pm Reply
    1. Bunkum

      ahh – the sweet reply of the EUNI>TGRADS crew…

      January 26, 2012 at 1:28 pm Reply
  10. NullSecHoBo

    Poet you need to go out more. "That there is the crux of the issue. When you’re raised in an environment that is chock full of rules, you come to expect that the outside world should be rules-based as well. " – really? ever heard of NRDS? NBSI? How about you try to build and sell supers to reds? What are they, guidelines?

    You are always <- this -> close to making a useful point, but your blind dislike of the Uni keeps getting in the way…

    January 25, 2012 at 7:55 pm Reply
    1. corelin

      NBSI = Not Blue Shoot It. That is a long way from "don't shoot this person here, don't shoot this person here, this POS is off limits, don't even go here,"

      NRDS is a little more complicated, but EvE Uni is Byzantine. Maybe not as insane as PS makes it out to be, but they make the old days of CVA look normal.

      January 26, 2012 at 2:16 am Reply
      1. Zenver

        Not sure what uni you're talking about, but the uni I know is NRDS in lowsec, and NBSI in null-sec. It's really -not- that confusing.

        January 30, 2012 at 4:28 am Reply
  11. Former Uni Member

    Eve Uni is embarrassingly idiotic and too many people there have their heads up their asses.

    January 25, 2012 at 8:24 pm Reply
  12. BlackConsul

    Ah yes, the paranoid and biased ravings of Poetic Somethingorother. New election cycle is barely even announced and already they're starting a smear campaign on even vaguely potential candidates.

    January 25, 2012 at 10:37 pm Reply
  13. Qwerty4812

    lets all dec war on eve uni and just remove it from the game… make it a holiday.. all of null sec units and decs eve uni for a week slaughtering everything

    January 25, 2012 at 10:53 pm Reply
  14. stfumkII

    shit article is shit

    January 26, 2012 at 1:45 am Reply
  15. Bunkum

    The situation is a little more complicated than just eve uni are carebears who hate pvp. The core purpose of the uni is to teach people new eve how to play the game – which is good. The problem is that the numbers in eve uni are no longer new players. About 20-30% of their numbers are new players – the rest are veteran players who use the uni as a social club to hang out in, make ISK and have people with less experience who can be regaled with tales of mythical things such as capitals and bubbles that they once saw.

    It makes no sens for the current Uni leadership (Kelduum) to change this status quo – he is essentially a career politician in eve – joining as a new player back in the days of the big blue before being made diplomat, director of operations and finally CEO. He has a large block to vote him into a nice CSM seat, irrespective of how little he knows about the game or how terrible his ideas are.

    As for pvp, Kelduum recently decleraed a "no war time sop" time for members to sho them how terrible a lack or rules are – and how they would suffer from wardecs. He then wardecced other groups in order to force players into agreeing that endless sets of rules were required

    Ultimately Eve uni has drifted away from what it was meant to do and now exists as the personal fiefdom of Kelduum – rules give him meaning in the game and allow him to shape it. RvB do no operate in the same way – this was never going to end well. The best thing to do with the uni is ignore it – it's past reform. There is nothing special it does any more – plenty of other corps will take on very new players and show them how the game works.

    Poetic might have a bee in his bonnet about the uni but that doesn't make what he is saying less true.

    January 26, 2012 at 1:55 pm Reply
  16. KBwhore

    RoE, wtf is this shitt ?

    I do understand that most of uni veterans are spending time is highsec incursion sites (that btw ais changing soon, and no whining on ccp doors gonna change it) and have kinda limited view to the real game, but get real UNI. What is next2be: " oh , w8 I wasnt ready for fight,, my mom just called" !?

    I belived that definition of war in eve is: shoot it 1st, shoot ih harder, if he is in pod – shoot the pod, poke the corpse and shoot it again – just to be sure (and hope that juicy implants are whushgone), no faking roe or whatever other excuses. War is war.

    Just a thought, how'bout to move to test server completly uni ?

    January 29, 2012 at 12:52 pm Reply
  17. woodmitulsio

    genius.

    February 23, 2013 at 7:02 am Reply

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